Is Your UVP Costing You Guests?

If your unique value proposition doesn't help you make better decisions faster, then it's maybe just a slogan instead of, you know, unique value proposition. Welcome to the future of Hospitality Podcast. I'm your co-host Gabi. And today we're joined by Anu, co-founder of Mooder App, the experience-driven management platform built for hotels and resorts. Anu went from a competition lawyer to a travel tech entrepreneur, and she's obsessed with market clarity. And today she will tell us how to know if we have a clear unique value proposition. So Anu, welcome. Thank you. What is the first action a travel entrepreneur should take to truly know their market rather than guess? Well, you know, I mean, you can conduct market studies and pay a lot of money for it. Or I think the easy way out is simple. Simple. You just talk to your customers. It's as easy as that. You talk to them, you actually listen to them, you ask them how they found you, what they liked, what they don't like. And if you're really good at it, you actually find out where they might have gone instead. And so if you can then write all that down and describe your ideal customer, then voila, you have your market. It is kind of simple. If you say it's like that, or I just have a conversation with the people that are coming and that you want to target, why are people doing that? That is actually a question. We actually do that quite a lot. We talk to our customers, we talk to the nice ones, we talk to the difficult ones, and then we sort of try to figure out what is making them happy with Mooder, why they probably are not happy. And then we try to figure out a solution. They usually think they know the solution, but we think we know better. But so far so good. It's working quite nicely. But I don't know. I mean, you think that people in hospitality industry, they are social, so they should use that superpower that they have. But they're just not using, or maybe they don't know, right? They're just thinking that they can go off their own guts. Talking about guts, let's do a quick fire. I will give you two options or a quick question, and you try to answer it, yeah, like quick fire. Are you ready? All right. Hopefully. A boutique resort or a big rent for Mooder? Oh, boutique. I love storytelling and individuality every time. Okay, what's one travel buzzword you would like to ban? Corkation. It's just, you know, wrong one. So many levels. What is non-negotiable in a guest room? Cleanliness. Yeah, I would agree with that. I mean, it is the foundation, right? Yeah, true. Best season to visit Finland? I'd say all, but spring. I mean, people come here for snow, right? And they want to see that. But if you come here in the middle of winter, it's just mega dark. So maybe the spring sort of nice, sunny day in the Lapland might be nice. That's my favorite season anyway. Oh, yeah, I think also the spring would be really nice in Finland. Okay, the last one. What is the favorite customer quote that you got? Oh, this is probably from early on, but I think it's still true. A customer once said that if you know how to read, you know how to use Mooder. And I think it's like, it says it all. Probably the best one ever. Yeah, I think that's so interesting that they say that, right? Because they, yeah, resort and hotel managers now use a lot of tools. And if you can read, you can use Mooder, which is nice. Can you tell me about the moment you spotted the problem of, yeah, resort managers and hotel managers having a lot of tools? And why did you or the Mooder team say, okay, I want to solve that problem? Well, he actually started with a person of frustration. My husband, who is the co-founder and our CEO is actually a third generation resort manager, resort owner. And then, well, he was struggling with the issue of a tech stack. And he figured out that there needs to be something easier to manage my accommodation and my activities and food and beverage and stuff. And he didn't find one. And so then he called several colleagues or other resort owners and asked them, well, how are you dealing with this? And they all had the same issue that, well, there isn't a good, like one solution that cuts it all. And so, well, he's an engineer by education and he was like, you know, it's not that hard just to build a modern tool. And so that's how it sort of started. We actually did a mini market study to understand if this really is a thing or not. And then, well, you know, after he came up with the idea that we should build our own system than me being a lawyer and having focused, I'm like a strategy nerd. I love studying strategies and why businesses do what they do. And I'm like, okay, so there's a loop in the market. I want to see if we can make this big. So that's how sort of the team started originally. Yeah. So combining the value proposition that you have to the resort and hotel managers and being a lawyer, what is, yeah, would you say the real competitor is maybe a messy tech stack? Or would it be maybe the neighboring hotel? Or both for murder? No, for the hotel resort. So is the real competitor or is the real competitor of murder the messy tech stack? Oh, yeah, probably because, you know, if you're running a resort, it's never you can't run it on a regular PMS. So most of our customers, if they are switching for another system, they're actually switching a tech stack to motor. So they're giving up something between two to five systems to switch to motor. Yeah. And yeah, you already said you went from your competition lawyer to travel tech founder right now. How was that step? Well, I think it was multifaceted. It's sort of easy because I actually, in addition to being a competition lawyer, I did litigation. So we just basically just running big processes. So being a CEO always more or less the same thing. It just, it never ends. It always continues. But at the same time, I think like, from a female perspective, tech scene is a lot more, how should I put it, less inclusive than the legal field. I found myself being the only woman in the room far too many times, I think. Yeah, I can understand. I have the same thing. So I think we as women invading this space is a really good thing, right? Having our opinions about it. And I think that's also really cool what you did because you wrote a playbook for travel entrepreneurs on how an idea is not only the thing that builds a company, but rather also the hundred hard choices you need to make. What should we really, if we reach your playbook, what's the most important thing that you want to give to the travel entrepreneurs? I think it's, well, first of all, I think you need to have a strategy, whether it doesn't need to be a big book of strategies, but you need to know like, who are you building to and why hopefully, and then follow your personal values. And that's, that's like the easy part sort of create that. What is the, your value proposition that you're bringing to your customers? Why are you building your system? And that's sort of, that is a nutshell, I think. Yeah, and I think it's interesting that you say values because I know motor is really big on values, and it's really important. Is there, was there a time when you walked away from a decision to protect your company values? And what happened? Well, the biggest one, we were in early on in motor, we had this potential customer that would have been a large chain. So we basically would have gotten 50 customers with one deal. And we were negotiating at some point, we realized that the founders or the owners of the offset potential customer had very, very different values from us. And then we just said that this is a no go, like it's not going to happen. And when we explained them that, you know, we're, we're running a values based business here. And they were very surprised. They said, you know, business is business and values is values. And, you know, at some point it's not going to happen. We're not going to understand the other end ever. And I think the best thing that actually came out of it is that when we told our, our employees what happened and they were like, Oh, that is so cool. Like, I've never worked in a place where actually values matter a lot. So I mean, I feel better, I sleep better. I think I would have. I think that's such a cool story because I do think a lot of companies often do what, what the company said, right, business is business and values are values. But I think it's really interesting that I think we are also heading to a time where values are becoming more and more important. And how do values and yeah, unique value propositions align together? Is there a kind of a relationship between those things? Well, I think they should. Like, how should I put it? Like, if you think about what's your unique value proposition, it's usually defined as you should have it. It should be clear. It should be relevant and it should be memorable. And for me, how I see clear or the clarity part is that it's something that helps you make better decisions. If your unique value proposition doesn't help you make better decisions faster, then it's maybe just a slogan instead of, you know, unique value proposition. If you tell it to your customer and they don't care, well, then you're probably either building the wrong team or trying to sort of convince the wrong customer pool. And then finally, the memorability I think is like, it's an easy one. It's like if you remove your name from that sort of proposition, no one would know whether it's the chain hotel next door or your place, then it's not really a memorable one, is it? And then all of that should come back by pretty clear sort of a route where to head to. Yeah. And let's say if an hotel or resort has that crystal clear UVP, right? How do they bring that over to their product, to their team training, to the guest's touchpoints that they have? Well, let's assume, like I think examples, I love examples, let's assume that you are a family friendly resort, for example, then presumably you would like children, you may have a playground, you should probably have some sort of high chair in your, you know, like you think what children need and then what do parents who have children need when they come to vacation? And it's just, it should be everywhere. Or if you are proposing a luxury resort, then probably community isn't that important. They're probably looking for a place where they can be just, you know, in their own luxury piece instead of building a community. So they're sort of, know your customer, ideally maybe you might have been the customer yourself. So if you're trying to build a luxury resort, but you're never traveled anywhere apart from hostels, then you might be in a bit of a pickle. But it's thinking how you would, what you would need if you were in their shoes, I think. Did I answer your question? Yeah, of course, yeah. And I think what you're saying is like the message of your available proposition needs to be ever, right? It needs to breed and breed out in the whole property, but also in the guest journey. And I think one of, I think I know that one of the things of Mooder is mobile apps, guest mobile apps, which also say it's important to incorporate that, that value proposition within that app, so that people are constantly told the story of your value proposition. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Because, you know, if you work in a resort, it's quite different from working in a hot, in just a traditional hotel, you're very likely not sitting on your desktop, instead you are, you know, browsing the property and you're moving from one building to another. And then you actually need to work using your, your mobile and needs to be fast and working. Yeah. And I, of course, we are also like in an economic world. So economics are also helping businesses or not helping businesses. How do you prevent your UVP from slipping into price competition under pressure? One of my favorite subjects is like, well, you know, obviously pricing is important, but competing on price alone is always a race to the bottom. Like it's the economic principle one on one or whatever. There will never be loyalty on price alone. Even if you're a budget hotel or you're a hostel or whatever, there will always be another hostel or whatever that has like a more efficient procurement team, whereas then they can push the price lower. And if you're only competing on price, then well, your customers are probably price sensitive, and then they will leave. Whereas even if you're that budget hotel, well, then you can compete on the community or on cleanliness or on location or whatever it is and be budget friendly. So, you know, it's the price alone. If I'm hearing is correct. Yeah. Are we like going to an experience led economy? So where experience are the differentiator instead of the price? Well, that's what we think and we're betting on that. I mean, we think that like people don't travel to sleep, they travel to experience, they may travel to be in an Instagrammable place or maybe tick tockable or what you want to call it. But regardless, they're looking for experiences. And then it's not just the bed or the cheapness, but sort of the entire package that you get when you travel, that's what we think. Yeah, I agree. I think we're changing travel instead of where am I going, why I'm going to that place, right? So I think storytelling, the UVP should be experience led and should be from the beginning understandable. If I want to go to a luxurious hotel, there needs to be different images, different storytelling, then for example, going to a budget hostel where I just want to see museums. So I really understand that. Can you share a recent example where experience led packaging and messaging became the clear differentiator for one of your case studies? Yeah, absolutely. We have been working with Harry Neewa. That's one of the biggest resorts in the Finnish land and probably one of the biggest in the Nordics. It's a large safari resort or actually it's three resorts. It's family owned. Very early on they decided that they would not be just offering accommodation. And then in addition, you know, we have these activities. Instead, they started building these experience room back packages. And they've been one of the first. And you know, in Lapland, the general or the average length of stay is somewhere between one and three days. Whereas Harry Neewa, it's between five and seven days. So people stay a lot longer. They travel there for the Huskies, for the reindeer and for the northern light safaris. So when they they spend, give or take a week there, maybe a little less, but they experience the entire magic of Lapland at the same time. So that's sort of their their UVP and it's working quite well. And how did you incorporate that UVP, for example, in the booking process or the management process? Well, in general, they like previously how they came to touch with Mooder is that they were running the business on a tech stack. And what it led to was that they they weren't able to sell the packages as easy, but also that they had several people who were there just to manage sort of the whole system to make sure that all the data was there where you needed so that people knew where to go to and at what time and so forth. And for that past two years, we've been interviewing them to understand the entirety of the complex resort business, and then providing them solutions with Mooder. And so now they finally have this one solution that enables them to provide good service to their customers, instead of you know, just serving the tech lords. I think it's interesting, you say like all the data in one, right? So you would have a kind of a single sort of truth? Yeah, sort of, yeah. Is that achievable or how do you see that? Well, Mooder works. So yeah, obviously, like if you want to do like very in depth revenue management, there are better tools than Mooder. But in general, like we have all the hospitality products in one system. So you can sell, you can operate you, but you also get analyze your data with Mooder. So that sort of makes you better decisions, you know, how your staffing works and so forth. Yeah. And would you say that having everything like in a single sort of truth, could be like a competitive advantage for your property? Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. Because it currently already helps them to like see the big picture, but then you slap in AI and you have magic coming out. I mean, like, AI is going to make, like amplify revenue, obviously, it's going to make everything faster and easier and like more efficient. But when you have it in a single system, then that's where the true magic happens, I think. Yeah, because AI can actually help, like how to suggest interneries, demand-based, softening or even dynamic swaps. When the weather changes, for example, like Leblanc, maybe it's rains one day, then snow, so then you have different activities. What are you the most excited about with this AI hype trend that's coming up? I mean, like, I think currently AI is mostly used for pricing in hospitality business. But like, if you only, like, if you have a tech stack, then I'm not a tech expert. But to my understanding, how AI works is like currently, you have one AI that can look at your PMS or your accommodation. But then if you also offer other hospitality products like food and beverage or activities, then the same AI has very limited view on that. So sort of then you can optimize your price on the accommodation, but not your price on the rest of the hospitality products. Whereas when you have all that in one system, then motor with AI could optimize the entire package. So basically, you could sell your accommodation a lot cheaper because you know that they will be buying all these activities and then that's where you get the money back or the revenue. So it's kind of, and then slapping all the staffing thing, that's a very big issue in hospitality, that you will have the right amount of staff every time. And if they're just rolling their thumbs, then AI will push more products to your customers to get full safaris. I think that's so interesting. And I'm really excited about the future. We talked about UVPs being a really important differentiator for your property. We talked about having a single source of truth. One thing that's also hot and happening right now is sustainability. Everybody wants to be sustainable. Everybody wants to also promote that to their guests. And would you say sustainability is a profit diver or something that is just a hygiene factor? So is it something nice to have or a must have for a property? Well, I think nowadays it's a must have, but a whole kill resort, which is about 45 minutes from Helsinki, is also a family-run resort. And they made this decision early on, about almost 10 years ago now, to use the whole business into climate work. And so what they did is that they made that sustainability strategy to sort of surpass the entire business. So they changed to e-cars. They changed to sustainable energy. They started building with materials that last for 100 years instead of a little less. They obviously are doing these tours to pluck out invasive species that don't belong in our nature here. And then all the basic stuff, obviously, as well. That was at the time when sustainability was really just a buzzword. And people said to them, you know, it's just, it will just cause you money, but it will bring you nothing. Well, they proved everyone wrong. What happened is that they actually became known for that sustainability edge. They were speakers pretty much everywhere. And that actually gave them the hype that they started getting more money because the customers were coming to them because they knew that this was a place that was actually sustainable. So that was really, really cool. I think it's interesting because then they make the right market selection at the beginning, right? They bet on the right horse. Is there one mistake you see repeatedly in properties selecting their market? And how can they fix that? Well, one thing is that if you don't know your customer base, like easy solution, like example is that you want to build to a luxury customer base, but you don't know how they work. You're not yourself personally that demographic. It means that you will need to learn a lot how they travel, what they expect. And if you don't do the work, well, it's not that's going to be a mismatch. People just won't come. The same goes, I think, for anything really. If you don't know how your customer base thinks, then, well, then you either need to learn or you will lose. Yeah. So actually, like, it's all starts with knowing your customer, right? Knowing where you could take what your market is, what your UVP is, and make that UVP clear, memorable. What was the third thing? Clear, memorable and relevant, relevant. Yeah. So those three things are important. And when you have that, try to have like a single truth, optimize your operations, make it more dynamic and impersonalized. And maybe AI will help that. And then probably monitor that market and like pivot your strategy and move forward. And it's a never ending story. But yeah, essentially. Yeah. So we're called, of course, the future of hospitality podcast. My last question is, of course, about the future. What will surprise hospitality entrepreneurs most about the next five years? And what will never change? Interesting. I don't know. I think at the end of the day, I mean, AI is a buzzword, but I think how much it will change the business will surprise everyone like how efficient and how much everything will change. Like, I mean, if we assume that people are traveling for experiences, then AI will make those experiences possible for many travelers, but they will also help you to manage that a lot more complex sort of customer wishes that are coming. And if you use that train, then you will be lost. However, what I think will never change is the human interaction. The need for sort of to talk with your customers and not just through AI. Yeah. So that human touch will be important in like knowing your customer also giving your customer kind of experience, right? Anu, I want to thank you so much for this brief into UVPs, how you competition, you can beat your competition, but also the case studies you talked about with Mooder, I love them. So thank you so much. Thanks. And that's it for this episode with Anu. 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